12/01/2017
11/29/2017
Natl. History Day (Shaun Lawton interviewed by Lindy Trout)
National History Day Interview Questions
The following is a transcript of Lindy Trout conducting an interview with the poet Shaun Lawton. This interview occurred in January of 2014. The poet's replies are in italics.
1. Who is Allen Ginsberg to the writing community?
In a nutshell, he is one of the leading poets of the Beat Generation who's poem HOWL was judged to be not obscene, thus helping to keep the way paved toward alternative culture and preserving Freedom of Speech.
2. The theme of our project is Rights and Responsibilities in censorship during the Beat Generation. Allen Ginsberg's poem Howl references illegal drugs and is sexually explicit, what was the responsibility of Ginsberg to censor Howl?
None, zero, zilch. His responsibility, which he fulfilled admirably in my opinion, was to avoid censoring it.
3. As a writer, what is your responsibility to censor your own work?
My responsibility in today's day and age, is to refrain from being exploitative in the area of rape. I think most everything else is pretty much fair game.
4. In 1957 City Lights Publisher Lawrence Ferlinghetti was arrested for Publishing the book Howl and Other Poems because its content was thought to be obscene. Did the government have the right to censor Howl?
No.
5. Who's ultimate responsibility is it to censor literature?
It begins with the author, and ends with their editor. Therefore, the ultimate responsibility lies with the editor.
6. Allen Ginsberg was truly revolutionary in his time? What lasting influence does the beat generation have on the literary world?
Yes, he was truly revolutionary for his time, on a lot of levels; personally, sexually, and spiritually. I think the beat generation's lasting influence can be summed up in one word, "alternative." Their work questioned everything that we came to accept about a normal society: from how literature itself is written and perceived, on through religious, sexual, and personal freedom. Their collective influence, I think, was strong enough to have become permanent. The Beats really did change the world for the better.
7.What influence has the beat generation had on you personally?
A tremendous influence. Writers and poets such as Lawrence Ferlinghetti, William S. Burroughs, Gregory Corso, Allen Ginsberg, and Gary Snyder have all woven their effect on me throughout my formative years studying poetry in college.
8. Why did you write a response to Allen Ginsberg's poem Capitol Air?
I was struck by the idea suddenly one day, that if Ginsberg were still around, what would he think? While reading through his collection PLUTONIUM ODE: AND OTHER POEMS 1977-1980, I discovered this poem of his which was really intended as a protest song (the sheet music on how to play it on guitar are included in the book), and reading it I was struck by how it was written from the perspective of one man (Ginsberg) railing against the corruption he sees taking root in our government. I decided to change the perspective from "I" to "we", twisting the original's viewpoint around to the point of view of we, the people today. Instead of raging against the things Allen protested in the original, we not only appear to have accepted it in my version, but I took it one step further, and wrote it from the perspective of the conservative, fundamental rightwing point of view. My version echoes each line of Ginsberg's original, resulting in a parody of sorts intended to reflect upon how little we've come during the intervening years since Allen wrote his version.
9. What influence do you think your poem had of the literary world? What kind of responses did it get?
My poem is featured on my free blog Triggerdreams, and no one responded. However, I was lucky enough to be invited to perform my spoken word poetry at LitPunk II, an alternative to "LitQuake" put on in the San Francisco Bay area by cyberpunk rocker and author John Shirley. The place was packed and my reading of Capitol Airs was met with fervent applause. I have it uploaded to my YouTube channel for posterity.
10. Howl and Other Poems is indecent, but it was ruled not obscene, it was saved by its “redeeming social importance”. Should indecent material be allowed to be sold to the general public?
Yes, of course it should. That is the hallmark of our country. We have freedom of speech here. If the material is too graphically explicit for younger persons, I think it's okay to label it as such and be sold as 18+ or whatever, because we also have a responsibility to properly guide the developing minds of our children.
11. What is the redeeming social importance of Howl?
Principally that it shows by example what taboos from the mid-20th century warranted controversy here in our country, and yet withstood judgment as not being obscene. It remains as a stark reminder today, that controversial issues considered taboo by the mainstream have been hard fought for and won already. Besides that, it has survived the test of time and may be read today for the expressive beauty of its poetry alone.
12. Is offensive content necessary to poetry? Is Censorship necessary to poetry?
Absolutely not. Although some good editing might improve almost any poem.
13. Some major censorship cases include Roth v. United States (1957), Jacobellis v. Ohio (1964), Memoirs v. Massachusetts (1966), Kois v. Wisconsin (1972), and Miller v. California (1973). Why were obscenity cases common in the 1950s, 60s, and 70s?
It was a far more innocent era, back then; but remember, our country is largely based on Puritanism. So back in the 50s, the puritanical aspect was far more paramount, then.
14. The Beatniks became popular during the early stages of the Cold War when foreign powers and McCarthyism kept people in fear. Was Beat poetry a social statement specific to that time period or was it intended for all generations?
Although it certainly was specific to that time period, I think most of the beat writers were artistic and prescient enough to inform their work with a degree of timelessness, so that it might be remembered far into the future. Many of the better beat writers were masters of their craft. Viewed in this light, I think it's safe to say that the best ones intended their work to inform all generations to come, and from where I sit, it appears they are still influencing our current generation of more serious writers.
The following is a transcript of Lindy Trout conducting an interview with the poet Shaun Lawton. This interview occurred in January of 2014. The poet's replies are in italics.
1. Who is Allen Ginsberg to the writing community?
In a nutshell, he is one of the leading poets of the Beat Generation who's poem HOWL was judged to be not obscene, thus helping to keep the way paved toward alternative culture and preserving Freedom of Speech.
2. The theme of our project is Rights and Responsibilities in censorship during the Beat Generation. Allen Ginsberg's poem Howl references illegal drugs and is sexually explicit, what was the responsibility of Ginsberg to censor Howl?
None, zero, zilch. His responsibility, which he fulfilled admirably in my opinion, was to avoid censoring it.
3. As a writer, what is your responsibility to censor your own work?
My responsibility in today's day and age, is to refrain from being exploitative in the area of rape. I think most everything else is pretty much fair game.
4. In 1957 City Lights Publisher Lawrence Ferlinghetti was arrested for Publishing the book Howl and Other Poems because its content was thought to be obscene. Did the government have the right to censor Howl?
No.
5. Who's ultimate responsibility is it to censor literature?
It begins with the author, and ends with their editor. Therefore, the ultimate responsibility lies with the editor.
6. Allen Ginsberg was truly revolutionary in his time? What lasting influence does the beat generation have on the literary world?
Yes, he was truly revolutionary for his time, on a lot of levels; personally, sexually, and spiritually. I think the beat generation's lasting influence can be summed up in one word, "alternative." Their work questioned everything that we came to accept about a normal society: from how literature itself is written and perceived, on through religious, sexual, and personal freedom. Their collective influence, I think, was strong enough to have become permanent. The Beats really did change the world for the better.
7.What influence has the beat generation had on you personally?
A tremendous influence. Writers and poets such as Lawrence Ferlinghetti, William S. Burroughs, Gregory Corso, Allen Ginsberg, and Gary Snyder have all woven their effect on me throughout my formative years studying poetry in college.
8. Why did you write a response to Allen Ginsberg's poem Capitol Air?
I was struck by the idea suddenly one day, that if Ginsberg were still around, what would he think? While reading through his collection PLUTONIUM ODE: AND OTHER POEMS 1977-1980, I discovered this poem of his which was really intended as a protest song (the sheet music on how to play it on guitar are included in the book), and reading it I was struck by how it was written from the perspective of one man (Ginsberg) railing against the corruption he sees taking root in our government. I decided to change the perspective from "I" to "we", twisting the original's viewpoint around to the point of view of we, the people today. Instead of raging against the things Allen protested in the original, we not only appear to have accepted it in my version, but I took it one step further, and wrote it from the perspective of the conservative, fundamental rightwing point of view. My version echoes each line of Ginsberg's original, resulting in a parody of sorts intended to reflect upon how little we've come during the intervening years since Allen wrote his version.
9. What influence do you think your poem had of the literary world? What kind of responses did it get?
My poem is featured on my free blog Triggerdreams, and no one responded. However, I was lucky enough to be invited to perform my spoken word poetry at LitPunk II, an alternative to "LitQuake" put on in the San Francisco Bay area by cyberpunk rocker and author John Shirley. The place was packed and my reading of Capitol Airs was met with fervent applause. I have it uploaded to my YouTube channel for posterity.
10. Howl and Other Poems is indecent, but it was ruled not obscene, it was saved by its “redeeming social importance”. Should indecent material be allowed to be sold to the general public?
Yes, of course it should. That is the hallmark of our country. We have freedom of speech here. If the material is too graphically explicit for younger persons, I think it's okay to label it as such and be sold as 18+ or whatever, because we also have a responsibility to properly guide the developing minds of our children.
11. What is the redeeming social importance of Howl?
Principally that it shows by example what taboos from the mid-20th century warranted controversy here in our country, and yet withstood judgment as not being obscene. It remains as a stark reminder today, that controversial issues considered taboo by the mainstream have been hard fought for and won already. Besides that, it has survived the test of time and may be read today for the expressive beauty of its poetry alone.
12. Is offensive content necessary to poetry? Is Censorship necessary to poetry?
Absolutely not. Although some good editing might improve almost any poem.
13. Some major censorship cases include Roth v. United States (1957), Jacobellis v. Ohio (1964), Memoirs v. Massachusetts (1966), Kois v. Wisconsin (1972), and Miller v. California (1973). Why were obscenity cases common in the 1950s, 60s, and 70s?
It was a far more innocent era, back then; but remember, our country is largely based on Puritanism. So back in the 50s, the puritanical aspect was far more paramount, then.
14. The Beatniks became popular during the early stages of the Cold War when foreign powers and McCarthyism kept people in fear. Was Beat poetry a social statement specific to that time period or was it intended for all generations?
Although it certainly was specific to that time period, I think most of the beat writers were artistic and prescient enough to inform their work with a degree of timelessness, so that it might be remembered far into the future. Many of the better beat writers were masters of their craft. Viewed in this light, I think it's safe to say that the best ones intended their work to inform all generations to come, and from where I sit, it appears they are still influencing our current generation of more serious writers.
5/12/2017
This Bridge of Sorrows
I woke up this morning after a twelve hour sleep,
during which I experienced a bit of dreaming.
Somehow I found myself in the company
of very young twenty year olds. We were at a party.
They accepted me as being one of them,
despite my having been twice their age.
An old friend showed up, now a famous poet.
He looked younger too.
He leaned in and planted a firm kiss on my mouth.
Although somewhat taken aback, I accepted the kiss.
I could feel the coarseness of his stubble.
The rough maleness of it.
It was very casual, as if we were just saying
"Hello" to each other.
Granted, it had been many years since we last
hung out together.
Today I am worried about him and his wife.
We all know he is lingering by the clearing.
The clearing at the end of the road.
This has gotten me thinking about spirit.
What is spirit, if not the commonality of all things?
Could the great spirit have projected this image
of my friend into my dream?
There being essentially zero difference
between the two?
Is it possible my dream was that spirit bidding
us farewell for me?
Even while he may be slipping from his mortal shell,
unaware himself, God Itself
may have been sending me a message.
I hope and pray that my dear friend has not passed away yet.
Maybe this image in my dream was meant as a reminder.
A reminder that after all, we don't have that much time left.
A tap on the shoulder in my sleep,
to get myself to Boston this spring.
What is God but a word we invented
to signify what we don't understand?
About this existence, this magnetic planet,
this solar storm in which we live.
These great, nested spheres of unimaginable
energy animating us all.
Why are we all so divided in our beliefs
to the point of constant warring?
Because we survivors must live here together.
It must be that we only use a fraction
of our heart's muscle toward thinking.
Could it be that we have over-analyzed
every little thing into fruitlessness?
Allow me to provide just one example
in this endless forest of night.
It has been stated that to forgive is divine,
but what is forgiveness, then?
What is it to forgive, if not to merely pardon
someone for even the smallest thing?
In other words, the next time someone
whose beliefs are different than yours,
why not try an experiment, you know,
just for shits and giggles.
If they think something differently
than you, why not pardon them and listen.
Is there any such thing as an authority
on this great open wide green Earth?
If you just pardon someone's different
belief system, you have forgiven them.
To forgive does not necessarily mean that
the case in which it's done must be extreme.
If you are an atheist and believe in science,
does that mean you cannot believe in spirit?
If you're religious and believe in creationism,
does that mean you live in a dream world?
Do the laws of physics as we have come
to understand them even mean a thing?
This is why I have chosen to live
my life on middle ground.
It's a firm decision to establish
one's home on this bridge.
3/04/2017
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